Propagation accross folders

[ERBRO]

Hello,

Will propagation work accross folders ?  I'm using capture one session and the DNG are in one folder and the output in JPG or TIF are in another one.

Best regards
Eric Bromey

[Mario]

Sure.

It is irrelevant for IMatch where the versions of a master image are, as long as it can find them. And when it has found them, it can propagate metadata.

Having the master image in one folder, and the versions in a sub-folder or even on a different drive is a pretty common situation.

[ERBRO]

HEllo,

I'm still fighting to get the propagation to work.

I have for each event, a sub-folder with RAW and a second one with the created JPEG.

Example :

C:/pictures/Christmas 2024
C:/pictures/Christmas 2024/capture (contains the RAW) and to which I have assign keywords and faces
C:/pictures/Christmas 2024/output  (contains the JPG resulting of the editing of the RAW)

I can not figure out how to set the parameters in the file relations version windows in the "where to search" block as

1) "entire database" gives a pop up that it will be very slow  and is not recommended (what I understand)
2) "Master Folder" give the option Up, Down or Up and down
3) "Folder List"  I could put here "C:/pictures/Christmas 2024"  but that woulf mean I need to add each time I create and event  the folder here what is combersome.

Can iMatch cope with my file structure without having to choose the option "entire database" ?

Best Regards
Eric

[thrinn]

C:/pictures/Christmas 2024
C:/pictures/Christmas 2024/capture (contains the RAW) and to which I have assign keywords and faces
C:/pictures/Christmas 2024/output  (contains the JPG resulting of the editing of the RAW)
...
3) "Folder List"  I could put here "C:/pictures/Christmas 2024"  but that woulf mean I need to add each time I create and event  the folder here what is combersome.

Can iMatch cope with my file structure without having to choose the option "entire database" ?

Yes, IMatch can cope with this requirement.
The solution is to use the "Folder List" option, combined with Folder Patterns.
Following your example, your master file is in "C:\pictures\Christmas 2024\capture\". The so-called "path segment token" {p0} would resolve to this path. {p1} would resolve to the folder one level up, that is "C:\pictures\Christmas 2024\". You want to search for versions in a subfolder called "output", so you let IMatch search in "{p1}\output". Folder patterns are very helpful to access parts of a given path.

• Set "Where to search" to "List of folders".
• Set "Direction" to "Specified folders only".
• Use the Plus sign to the right with "Add pattern..." and enter "{p1}\output".

[ERBRO]

Hello,

Thank you for the advice. I tested it on a small DB but can not get it work. the keywords are not propagate. I suppose I still miss something but can not figure out what.

I set the relation as in attached printscreen.

Would the extension be case sensitive ?

Best regards
Eric

[thrinn]

Please show us a screenshot of the "Versioning" tab. The "Detection" tab makes sure that IMatch can identify versions of a given master. But the "Versioning" tab specifies what exactly  should be propagated. For example, to propagate keywords, you might want to set the checkmark for "XMP keywords" (or "XMP Keywords (Merge)". It depends on your workflow requirements which of the other options you might want to set or unset.

The "*" behind the XMP Keywords option is also important: It means that you have to perform a Metadata Writeback to trigger the propagation.



Please note that File Relations are already an advanced topic. There are a lot of specifics and options to cover different use cases. I understand that you are just evaluating IMatch, correct? Configuring File Relations in the IMatch help has a lot to say about File Relations. I use IMatch since around 2003, I believe, and I am still using the excellent IMatch help on a regular basis to lookup certain aspects.

But don't hesitate to ask in this community if you run into troubles or can't figure out something. Chances are very good that somebody can and will help you.

[Tveloso]

You should also note that Propagation happens when you write back the Master, so the JPEG will not contain the Metadata you have added to the Master, until after the Writeback takes place.

Also, after setting up the Version Relation as thrinn has advised (and having refreshed the relations - F4, R - as IMatch suggests, following changes to relation configs), you should ensure that IMatch has actually identified your files as Masters, having one or more Versions.  Your Link Expression may not be doing what you expect, and is failing to create the Version Set.

The Help Topic thrinn has linked to provides all the details.  Once IMatch has established a Version Set, the Thumbnail for the Master will contain this icon:

   

...and the Version(s) will contain this one:

   

If you don't see those Icons, either the rule is not working, of you have not refreshed the Relations.

[Tveloso]

...and I am still using the excellent IMatch help on a regular basis to lookup certain aspects.

Here here.  It will definitely be worth your while to read over the Help topics thrinn has linked to.

[Mario]

Did you check that the versions are detected?
They will show a version icon (see Versions in the File Window) and when you open the Version Panel via (View menu > Panels > Versions) and you select a master, the versions must show.

File extensions are not case-sensitive.

If your versions are properly detected, make sure to enable what you want to propagate on the Versions tab, as explained by @thrinn.

He also mentioned that versioning is an advanced feature. Usually this is not something you work while still on your first couple of days with the Trial version of IMatch.

Make sure you read the explanations in the corresponding help topic completely. Press <F1> in the Version dialog.
Don't just copy metadata between files. A lot of metadata is not really designed to be copied, or must be copied in entire groups.

XMP metadata like hierarchicalSubject, Description, date created, create date, XMP GPS data etc. are usually safe to copy.
Be selective.
Don't just copy all XMP data, unless you know what this means. Don't copy native EXIF or GPS data, stick to XMP.

[ERBRO]

Hello,

With the support above and the onlinr help, I figure out the issue.  I had a prefix (like _DSC in the online help) that was not taken in consideration.

Thank uou for the quick support.

Best regards
Eric

[Mario]

Very good!

Can you help me out? 

I know you're already working with advanced concepts like versioning. But you have recently started using IMatch, right?
What were your initial impressions? Where did you struggle first? Do you like the help system?

I'm always trying to make onboarding for new users easier. To make IMatch work right out-of-the-box for new users. Which is not easy, due to the wide variety of workflows, previous experiences and expectations.

If you have some comments or tips to share, let me know.

[ERBRO]

Hello Mario,

the major area where I did struggled  is around performance, background processes etc. 

- dashboard freezing each time a background task run.
- Difficulty to close imatch (for instance if I cancel the metadata write back, imatch will be unresponsive).
- I can not find a place to view all pending back ground tasks

The online help is fine but the (quick) support of this forum to interpret the online help is invaluable especially to explain quite technical topics to non IT people like me.

The video showing a few concepts is also very welcome.

Best regards
Eric Bromey

[Mario]

dashboard freezing each time a background task run.

Are you sure?

Because, when background tasks run, the Dashboard dims, shows a spinner icon and stops updating panels all the time - because it would be fruitless because the information displayed changes several times a second. You see the activity panels at the top, informing you about what IMatch is currently doing. Trying to keep the dashboard updated would only waste processing cycles.

Unless you make IMatch process tens of thousand of files, this should never be an issue.
What where you doing at the time?

I can not find a place to view all pending back ground tasks

The Info & Activity Panel

If your system struggles with processing demanding background tasks, reduce the number of parallel threads IMatch runs.
See Process Control (Advanced Setting)

Especially if your images are on a slow NAS or disk and your computer has many processor cores, your system may not be able to keep up.

Difficulty to close imatch (for instance if I cancel the metadata write back, imatch will be unresponsive).

Cancelling 20, 30 or more background tasks all waiting e.g. for Windows to return data or ExifTool to finish reading or writing can take a while. IMatch cannot prevent this, at some point it has to wait for the operating system or external helpers to finish processing. Especially if your system is maxed out or the files you are processing are very large.

If you experience such issues, the FIRST THING to do is to secure the IMatch log file (log file) after IMatch has closed by copying it to somewhere. IMatch logs what it is doing, how long things take, etc. Very helpful when diagnosing such issues and providing tips to the user.

I don't know if you were processing 100 JPG files at the time you experienced this, or IMatch was churning through tens of thousands of RAW and video files stored on a slow NAS. Big difference. The more details you provide, the better I can understand.

Typical "IMatch is slow" reasons are:

- virus checker scanning the database constantly
- too many large files processed and the system cannot copy
- video files being processed
- ExifTool running into a bad batch of files with tons of metadata errors, slowing it down from 5 files per 2 seconds to 1 file per 30 seconds
- System overloaded

If you have a log file, I can tell you more.