Viewer: Rejected image causing shift in photos

[Jingo]

Hi Mario - one more item that I just discovered ... the rejected files get moved to the end of the viewer instead of staying in place.

So - say you select 5 images and open them in the viewer... all 5 images are then compared and shown in the viewer.  The first photo is selected and I hit delete to mark as rejected.  

That image moves to the end of the 5, gets replaced with the reject circle and all the other images shift to the left.  What I would prefer to see is that first image get replaced with the reject circle (or even better - just dimmed 50% with the reject circle overlay) but remain in place while the focus just moves to the next image.  

This will allow continuity when moving through a set of images and allow the order in which they appear in the viewer to match the order they appear in the thumbstrip.

Hope that makes sense! - Andy.

[Mario]

I think this selection feature in the Viewer has over-complicated things way to much.
Piling more and more behaviors and special cases on top of it will be no good.

As far as I can tell from telemetry, you (and maybe less than five other users) are the only user actually using this, mixing selections you make in File Windows before opening the Viewer, loading them into the Viewer, than making a selection of the selection and then modifying this selection by marking files for deletion in combination with the Viewer skip deleted option and delete moves next option.

This is all to complicated now.

The general idea of the Viewer is simple: You select the files you want to see in a File Window and open them in the Viewer.
You can then navigate. compare multiple files, mark files for deletion and then decide what to do when closing the Viewer.

The feature requests you have posted has zero likes. And implementing even some of it would make the already complex navigation and scrolling and skipping marked files in the Viewer even more complicated.

I will not even consider this unless the feature requests get as least 20 likes or more, showing great demand.

The behavior in the Viewer when you mix File Window selections with ad-hoc selections in the Viewer in combination with marking files for deletion is maybe not 100% ideal, but it works in a reliable way. For me, this is good enough and not a bug. There are complexity limits, even for IMatch and me.

I regret adding the selection feature in the Viewer, because it adds so much complexity for such a small audience. I even have a to-do on my list to consider rolling this back, to make the Viewer easier to maintain in the future. I have added extra telemetry to learn how many people actually using this for this purpose.

[Jingo]

I'm a bit confused why my process is so unique and why more folks are using the viewer for comparing sub-selections of images? Are users not taking advantage of the image comparison feature within the viewer? 

To note: the same issue shows up even if you only load the viewer with 6 images from the File Window and then select all of them to compare and reject... it is not unique to making sub-selections in the viewer as far as I can tell from testing.

In IM2023, the system acted differently (and correctly) - when you rejected an image, the image low-lit but remained in the same location and the cursor simply moved to the next image. Once you moved through those images, the system wrapped. 

I would prefer this behavior to the wholesale removal of the selecting images in the viewer.. if you remove that feature - how can you then compare multiple images to each other?

[Mario]

Are users not taking advantage of the image comparison feature within the viewer? 

You can always compare images side by side in the Viewer, without making a selection on to of the selection already made in the File Window.

To note: the same issue shows up even if you only load the viewer with 6 images from the File Window and then select all of them to compare and reject.

Why do you make an extra selection when all files are already loaded in the Viewer. Use <L>,<6> to switch the Viewer to show six files.

In IM2023, the system acted differently (and correctly) -

Try to disable the "Skip deletes files" option in Edit > Preferences > Application.

[Jingo]

Thx Mario... so, I tried out your steps/settings (Skip Deletes File set to False) and it does make a difference.. but there is still an issue with "jumping" on the first image reject.  I attached a small MP4 (reduced resolution so it will upload - zipped) to show the problem.

Steps:
1 - select 21 images in the File Window
2 - launch the viewer
3 - viewer remembers last setting which was a 16 up compare (thx for the keyboard shortcut!)
4 - 16 images are loaded and I select one in the middle
5 - hit Delete to reject the image

The system loads another 5 images (because there are more than 16 to display) and repositions the images from this point forward. The cursor jumps to that first image which is the next image after the rejected one.  I understand why the system does this.. but it jumps the visual out of focus and removes the ability to compare images that came before the rejected item.

6 - choose a different image in the group and Delete to reject

The cursor moves to the next image after the rejected image and the images are not reloaded (correct) because there aren't any more to load.  If the viewer had another 50 images loaded (or if only 8 images were being compared), the same issue as #5 would occur over and over again until there were no more images to load from the original set.

[Mario]

I assume all that does only happen when you make a selection in the film strip in the Viewer?

[Jingo]

Hi Mario - nope.

This result happens even when I do not make any additional selection in the viewer.  The images are only selected in the File Window and opened into the viewer where the 16 up mode is loaded with the first 16 images automatically.  No interaction with the film strip occurs in the viewer for the issue to appear.

Also - sorry for the large text in the initial bug report... just noticed it.. lol.. whoops!

[Jingo]

Hi Mario - can I offer any other examples or information on this issue?  

Not sure if I should add more to this or just add my thoughts to the feature request I entered.  At the moment, it is difficult for me to use the viewer to compare/reject images because of how the viewer changes depending upon the number of images selected, shown in the viewer and how many are left in the thumb strip.

Appreciate your thoughts!

[Mario]

So - say you select 5 images and open them in the viewer... all 5 images are then compared and shown in the viewer.  The first photo is selected and I hit delete to mark as rejected. 

I cannot reproduce this.
I select 5 images in a File Window and open the Viewer.
Switch the layout with L,6 to show all files.
Select the 2nd file and press <Del>. The file gets the delete mark. But the order of files does not change.
This is what I see:



I have made some improvements on select files in File Window, select files from these files in Viewer (which also changes the number of image windows displayed) and then start rejecting files. IMatch now reduces the number of images displayed while you reject files while you keep rejecting.

Made some improvements for <Del>ing files in multi-image layout mode, not scrolling anymore. Scrolling is only required when one image is shown and it is <Del> with "del moves next" option enabled.

All this has become way to complicated for my taste now, unfortunately. Regret adding the selection option in the Viewer. Stupid of me to implement this feature request. Dynamic layouts with dynamically changing images within the grid etc.

[Mario]

I consider this bug fixed with these changes and close it. See https://www.photools.com/release-notes/ for more information. Comment on this thread when the next version is out as needed, if you can still reproduce this.

[Jingo]

Thx Mario - I cannot reproduce the "choose 5 and reject" either now... so, it must be some combination of events like opening up 60 images in the viewer, rejecting and then coming back to the file window and choosing just 5 to repeat.  I will play around and see if I can come up with steps to reproduce.

I'll check out the release-notes and report back after the update.  Appreciated!

[Jingo]

Thx Mario - just tested the latest version and it is working super well now... Chose 40 images in FW, Viewer set to 16 compare, hitting Reject on an image leaves it in place, marks as rejected and moves to the next image. Upon reaching the end of the 16, an entire new set of 16 images is shown and on we go until we reach the end.  Perfect!

I then exit the viewer, wait for my filter to hide the rejected images, hit Enter to go to the viewer again and review a 2nd round for rejecting.. rinse repeat as often as needed to whittle down the images.  

Personally, I think the if the option to "Skip Deleted Files" is set to "Y", then the system should also NOT include them in the compare display [just as thumbnails] because the rejected images in the compare are low lit anyway makes it very hard to perform further compares when the viewer loads many images)...but the current workflow to exit/re-enter the viewer works just fine too.

Thanks again for fixing this.. back to burst mode comparing!!

[Mario]

Feel free to make a new feature request.

[sinus]

...
Personally, I think the if the option to "Skip Deleted Files" is set to "Y", then the system should also NOT include them in the compare display [just as thumbnails] because the rejected images in the compare are low lit anyway makes it very hard to perform further compares when the viewer loads many images)...but the current workflow to exit/re-enter the viewer works just fine too.
...

GREAT stuff to see 16 images together, works super.

In the point above, I agree completely, and if you once creates a FR for this, like Mario offers, I would give it a yes for sure. 
It is not a big thing, of course, but it would help. 

[Jingo]

Thx Mario/Markus - I have entered the FR here: https://www.photools.com/community/index.php/topic,14935.msg104586.html#msg104586

Appreciated!!