New Open AI Model

[Mario]

A couple of days ago, OpenAI released their latest model, the o4* generation.

I've just finished integration for the affordable o4-mini model and the next release of IMatch will support it.
There were some API changes to deal with, some parameter names differ between the gpt-40* models available so far and the new o4* generation etc. But it's now all working. I will support the gpt-40* models for a while, as OpenAI still offers and supports them.

[Stenis]

I asked you about the status about the support for the newest version of the OpenAI API 4.1 yesterday. Sorry if it was not in a  place you expected it to be and that you had issues wwith the semantics.

Concerning my use of the word "interface" I did not mean the interface displaying the models we can chose between there but the interface between imatch and the new API.

"There were some API changes to deal with, some parameter names differ between the gpt-40* models available so far and the new o4* generation etc. But it's now all working. I will support the gpt-40* models for a while, as OpenAI still
offers and supports them."

As you write above which is an excerpt from your yesterday posted in your earlier comment to my earlier post this was just what I ment. Call it what you want but for me this is just an example where there is a need to adapt your interface of iMatch to the API of OpenAI 4.1.

When I looked at this site yesterday I must have missed this particular tread - or your tread had not even been posted yet. No strange with that since I always works in the nights till around 4 in the mornings  - the reason is that it is the only time I can count on not been disturbed and get something done with my archive.

I will probably continue posting things in the wrong places in your structure  - sorry for that - but I might not being really used to all these headlines in big fonts that is not what determines these structures since it is much more in the substructures. Hopfully I will learn better.

My question was not just about the mini-model either. I use the bigger model as well (GPT--40) and if the newer 4.1 mini as good as the old 4.0 interpreting pictures, support for the new mini-model will be highly important and much anticipated, that was why I posted the link with all those diagram examples that pointed to some really remarkable gains with the new models both when it comes to efficiency and costs.

The new models are much faster as well and that is the biggest problem with GPT-40 for me today since it takes at least 20 seconds per picture today for me. If the mini- model can make the same job with the same quality in the "Descriptions" as the bigger model gives today but with the speed of the mini -model od OpenAI or like Gemma 3 witch makes the same job in 3-4 seconds that will be a true game changer for both quality and productivity.

I posted my link at 01:29:24:

https://www.photools.com/community/index.php/topic,15128.0.html

You posted this tread at 01:29:39

[Mario]

I will probably continue posting things in the wrong places in your structure  - sorry for that -

Please try not to. Read the descriptions. The community moderators have only so much tolerance...

The new models are much faster as well and that is the biggest problem wit

What makes you think that? The marketing blurb posted on the OpenAI website?
Maybe for some specific use cases for reasoning models not relevant for IMatch.

I see no real difference in response time, latency or quality between gpt 4.1 and o4* and the previous models so far.
For my standard prompt (description, structured keywords and Headline trait) o4-mini responds in between 8 and 15 seconds, depending on how busy OpenAI's data centers and Cloudflare are. Depends a lot on the prompt, of course.

[Stenis]

We'll see. I have to test on my own material. What is most important for me too is the accuracy with which the mini-models actually follows my instructions too. In that respect Gemma has been worst. Generally and verbally it is very good but I don't like the lack of structure and how bad it follows instructions for my  "mandatory textlines" I need in Descriptions". In that respect OpenAI has been fully satisfactory. I want the first lines in Desciptions to hold structured info about place country and year a picture is taken. Only OpenAI so far has fixed that with my prompting.

So far only GPT-40 has been able to live up too my demands when analyzing image content when it comes to animal species and deliver species, their latin name and the family they belong to. GPT-40 has been almost 100% on that so far with many houndreds of pictures tested in production (very happy with that). Both 40-mini and Gemma was hit and miss and disappointments in that respect.

If the new mini-model manages to interpret species accurately and get even better writing and structuring my mandatory structures of text I'm home. The present mini-model and Gemma takes much more of prompt adaptions than the GPT-40 does.So using GPT-40 today is much more simple and convenient and less labor intens than the others of that reason. So what I hope for is a higher productivity than we get today by even better accuracy, better followed instructions and better image analyzes. If their datacenter is overloaded or not can of course affect the throughput but that is really out of the scope discussed here.

If a service provider overstates their services performances that will very soon be verified in a number of already present standardized tests on the net that makes comparissons over time possible and that is already happening to a seemingly large extent now. So I don't think OpenAI would get away with that all "marketing bull" you talk about that easy.

The difference between our opinions and experiences and those sources is that they are using standardized empiric tests and I think I trust them far more than the ones we are able to conduct here even if many of them are covering usage in manny other fields than "vision" and image analyses that are far out of scooe when it comes to the way we use these API:s here.

... and the expert on my way to use these API:s is myself and nobody else and I have so far had no problem to see what works most effectively for me. What is very important though is to distinguish between the real empirically verified technical performance in various benchmarks of these different API:s and the most effective use of them in my own or even your workflows and that is the real issue here when it comes to my real benefits of these new versions.

It shall be very interesting to see how these new API:s will perform IRL and it is very good iMatch is as future safe as it is as it is able to adapt to the rapid development by adopting new API:s as they are released and you are able to make them available for us. I won't disturb you  for now so you better can concentrate on preparing that new version. Good luck with that task!

[Mario]

See https://www.photools.com/release-notes/