enhancement selection: pick-up

[sinus]

When we select files, we can do this, like the help-file explains:

To select a file in the file window, left-click it. This will also make the file the focused file, indicated by a yellow border.

To select multiple files, use left-click to select the first file you want to select. Then hold down Shift and left-click the last file you want to select. The File Window selects all files between the currently selected file and the file you click last.

When you Ctrl+click a file, it becomes the selected and focused file. When you do that while multiple files are selected, you can un-select individual files as follows: Ctrl+click the file you want to un-select to make it the focused file. Then Ctrl+click another file.

When you click the file window while another window or panel has the input focus the file window just becomes activated but does not change the selection. This allows you to set the input focus back on the file window (to use keyboard commands), without accidentally changing the selection.


That is fine. But if I want select quite a lot of files, with files, what I do not want select, than the danger is, that I make something, what looses the selection.
Or it is simply annoying, always hold down the Ctrl-key and add more files with the left mouse.

A solution, what I currently does, is select some images and then add a collection. But then the collection must be empty before.
Also the same with a category.

One solution I could imagine, is this:
It would be fine, if IMatch would offer a kind of "Pick-up-Button".
This means:

I click on this "Pick-up-Button", what could be in the caption bar or somewhere else.

This would mean for IMatch: Every single file or several files, what I click on it, are selected.
For a reminder, this selection could have another color as the normal selection.

I could select several files, select single files and so on, every file would be part of this selection.
If I want deselect a file, I simply click on it again.

So I could select hundrets of files, it does not matter, I must not fear to loose the selection.
I can pick up files, like a chicken, here a grain, there two and so on.

This special selection - mode ends not until I push the "Pick-up-Button" a second time (I have the changed color as a reminder, that I am still in the pick-up-mode).

If I push the "Pick-up-Button", the special color of this pick-up-selection turns into the normal selection-view, but all files, what I have picked off, are now selected.

From now on, the selection behaves like a normal selection and is a normal selection.

This would make it easier to select images for a slideshow or an output or whatelse we want collect files.

Of course this is a minor thing, but it could make life easier, when we want select a lot of different files, scattered in the file window.

Thanks for listening.

[JohnZeman]

For what it's worth Markus, this is the way I use bookmarks.  Select one or more files and press the B key.  Select some more files, press the B key again to add those to the bookmarks collection.  If I need to remove some files I switch to bookmarks, select the unwanted file and press the B key to remove them from bookmarks.  Of course as you say you have to start out with an empty bookmarks collection but that's a minor thing, at least to me.

[sinus]

For what it's worth Markus, this is the way I use bookmarks.  Select one or more files and press the B key.  Select some more files, press the B key again to add those to the bookmarks collection.  If I need to remove some files I switch to bookmarks, select the unwanted file and press the B key to remove them from bookmarks.  Of course as you say you have to start out with an empty bookmarks collection but that's a minor thing, at least to me.

Hi John
thanks for your input ... I do the same ... mostly.

But the bookmarks must be empty  and I can loose my selection also, if I do a lot of selecting files.

If it would be easy to program this, I am sure, this would be a small, but fine enhancement for selecting files. I can remember, users lost also the selection, if they clicked somewhere else.

But you are correct: bookmark and other stuff will do it also, this whole idea of me is a minor thing, no question.

[JohnZeman]

Markus what you said reminded me that maybe I should upload the script I use (which I just now did) to empty my collections in case anyone else might find it useful.

Thanks for jogging my memory about that.

[sinus]

Markus what you said reminded me that maybe I should upload the script I use (which I just now did) to empty my collections in case anyone else might find it useful.

Thanks for jogging my memory about that.

jogging the memory sounds cool. 

John, it is so, that I use all my collections for different things. Every collections is occupied by a special meaning.
Only the bookmarks are free to use it for me.

But I have often some images in the bookmarks, for a temporary job, and usually I want not empty the bookmarks, for simply add a selection.
(BTW: thanks for your script, they are always interesting)

I would say it so:
If you had such a pick-up-button, you would press it, and you could select, unselect, select single images, select several images, without having press B, simply click with your mouse here and there, also Shift, Ctrl-clicking ... and when you would be finnished, you would press the magic button again ... and you would have your selection for sure (where you could, if you want, press B now) ... if you had such a button, could you imagine, that this would be easier for you and would you use it?

Since I do - like most of us - often use selections, I am able to do a selections quite quickly. But if I want have a quite large selection, it is always a bit akward to do so. Of course I can do it, but with such a button, I think, such a selection would be much easier (and safer).

I have no clue, how difficult it would be, to program such a button. I think, IMatch should only create so somewhere inside its magical engine store the picked names of the images, and that's it.

But maybe I am completely wrong, and it is difficult with a lot of work. In this case, of course, I would not do it, if I where Mario.

[Mario]

I have no clue, how difficult it would be, to program such a button.

Good question. Lets think about it:

- Design a button for the toolbar in Photoshop, in several variants. Export to PNG files.
- Change the file window toolbar to include the button.
- Add command handlers to the file window.
- Add new resources, message boxes, info tips as needed to the IMatch resource files.
- Add all the code required to override the current code which deals with keyboard and mouse selections (which is quite a lot)
- Add the code to handle the special selection mode.
- Test all this stuff.
- Add a new section to the file window help topic, explaining the new selection mode
- The volunteer translators need to translate all new resources
- Search the help for all screen shots including the file window toolbar and re-create the screen shots (this alone will take several hours).

Maybe 1.5 - 2 work days.

[Carlo Didier]

This is a similar problem to what I had (and still have) with the way files are deselected. I still have lots of files assigned to wrong categories because I needed to Ctrl-Click TWICE an already selected file to un-select it (which I didn't). Which is completely counter-intuitive and does not correspond to any known behavior of other applications.
Problem is that too many users are now used to that and so it can't be changed anymore ... Maybe I'll write a script to make my own file selection window.

[sinus]

I have no clue, how difficult it would be, to program such a button.

Maybe 1.5 - 2 work days.

So, in this case I would not do this of course, 2 days are too long ... except 100 users want it. 
Thanks, Mario, for the clarification of your work.

Users, or at least me, tend to think, well, this cannot give a lot of work, but you must think not only at programing such things, but also to change a lot of things.

And - maybe the new code does make troubles in other aereas.
And like Carlo wrote, users does also lern a behaviour and independent, if the behaviour is good or not that good, they lern to use it.

I personally have not the troubles like Carlo has (though I can understand his position), so this is not important for me.

And I have not every day pick up a lot of images, so forget simply this Feature Request. There are enough other FR, what are really important, like one of mine. 

Thanks for listening and explaining.

[Mario]

One of the ideas behind collections (bookmarks, pins, dots, flags) was to allow users to 'produce' complex selections and temporarily store them in these collections. Exactly what John is doing with bookmarks.

Pressing <B> is as easy and quick as any other method, you can add/remove files with <B> any time etc. Once you're done, you switch to Bookmarks and perform whatever operation you want. Then clear bookmarks again with <Ctrl>+<A>,<B>. I doubt any kind of special "selection mode" you need to toggle with a button can be much faster or easier.

And you can even maintain multiple selections in different collections, see them in the Collections View, use them for filters, ...

[sinus]

One of the ideas behind collections (bookmarks, pins, dots, flags) was to allow users to 'produce' complex selections and temporarily store them in these collections. Exactly what John is doing with bookmarks.
I doubt any kind of special "selection mode" you need to toggle with a button can be much faster or easier.

And you can even maintain multiple selections in different collections, see them in the Collections View, use them for filters, ...

I do this since years, also with IM3.
Hence I think, I know, how quick adding a B can be. 

But in contrary to you I am sure and I would bet quite a lot of money, if such a "pick-up-mode" would exist, I woud be much more quicker than with bookmarking them.

Anyway, it does not matter, because 2 days is simply too much work for this, specialy, because selections works fine, no doubt, so simply forget this FR. 
Came only in my mind during last night. 

[Mario]

We'll let it sit for a while and see how many Likes it gets.
It's often hard to know (especially if you're not me) how long it will take to implement a feature. Something apparently tiny may mean several days or even weeks of development time - while other features (which are also often useful for many users) take only a few hours.

Some minor change in the non-UI code, or maybe a new scripting method is quick. As soon as it has something to do with the user interface, things become much more complicated and labor-intensive. A dialog box can take several days to develop. A new message box 0.5 to 1.0 hours (not counting the time the translators need). A new toolbar button also 0.5 to 1.0 hours (when I can come up with a good icon right away, else longer). And changes in a toolbar may also cause updates to several if not dozens of help pages - which can take many hours to re-create the screen shots etc.

Creating a new panel, several days of work. At least. Some of the panels took weeks or even months! to develop (Keyword Panel, Metadata Panel).

[sinus]

Thanks, Mario, exactly, let's look, how many likes ... I personally like the new like-possibility!