Windows 10 upgrade/installation

[Carlo Didier]

I thought I might share my experiences with upgrading to Windows 10.

First, my main desktop machine, an Intel Core i5 with 16GB RAM and 250GB SSD plus a 3TB data HDD, running Windows 8.1 Pro 64bit. Upgrade ran without problems through several reboots. I then played around with it for half an hour and shut it down. Next day, it constantly crashed on boot. I had to get it into safe mode with F8 on boot, disable some services to get it booting again. I had to uninstall and re-install (the latest version) of Eset SmartSecurity. Now it's working fine without any problems. Windows version is 10 Pro, as expected. When I get the time, I will do a clean install.

Second, my travel laptop, an old Pentium dual core with 8GB RAM and 250GB SSD, running Windows 7 Home Premium. This one was a bit ill, software-wise. I couldn't uninstall most applications anymore, but what was installed was running fine. Here, the upgrade failed with an unclear error. Some googling pointed me to the problem of a "SystemReserved" partition that was too small. I extended that from 100MB to 300MB (using MiniTool Partition Wizard Free) and the upgrade ran through without any problems. Everything worked (and continued to do so!). So, as it got properly activated, I took a backup image of the whole disk and then did a clean install. Windows installation went fine and it got activated. Now I have re-installed all my applications. This machine really works way better now than before. Windows version is 10 Home.

Oh, and on both machines, I followed the advice from here: Things to immediately disable in Windows 10 and other similar articles.

In my humble opinion, Windows 10 is what Windows 8 should have been (although I was fine with Windows 8 after installing "Start8" and disabling all the tablet-centric stuff that didn't make any sense on a big desktop).

[jch2103]

In my humble opinion, Windows 10 is what Windows 8 should have been...

I agree. Win 10 upgrade went without incident on both my old Dell desktop (Q6600 w/ SSD & 1 TB HD) and my several year old Sony laptop (SSD), with one exception. I'd previously had an issue with a Win 7 sound card update (had to revert to previous drivers). Win 10 apparently loaded the drivers that didn't work, so no sound at first, but the next day there was apparently an update and now everything works properly.

[Mario]

Except for my main development computer (I will migrate that in a few weeks, after giving MS some extra time) all my computers and my tablet now run Windows 10. No problems at all.

I had to do a repair installation of Windows 7 on one PC before switching because its Windows Installer database/system/whossname was so badly messed up that some updates could not be installed anymore (e.g. Internet Explorer 11 or the 'Get Windows 10' update). After the repair installation and re-installing about 200 (!) updates, Windows 10 installed without any problems. Took almost a day, though, to prepare this PC for the W10 install...

My main work environment is now Windows 10. And yes, I have also disabled all 'call home' or 'monitor the user' options for now. Most of these options are not really harmful, and at least Windows gives you options to disable most of them. Not like Android where you don't have such choices. Except you use something like CanogenMod, which I do 

I keep Windows 7, 8 and 8.1 in several versions in virtual environments so I can properly test IMatch and the installation and de-installation process. Updating all these systems and virtual environments after a Microsoft patch takes several hours. I hope that most users will switch to Windows 10 so I can reduce these efforts.

[Ferdinand]

Well this user isn't in a hurry to switch, although I'll probably migrate my laptop soon as a test-bed, since there's nothing really critical on there.  I expect that I'll do the desktop within the year.  If I had Windows 8 on any machines then I'd be in more of a hurry, but W7 works well and is comfortably familiar.  I hate disturbing my production environment.

There's an additional issue in that I'll need to revamp my backup software.  I am still using an very old version of ATI, even though I purchased a newer version.  [Long story, but partly based on concerns about bloatware in later versions.]  I'll probably switch to Macrium Reflect.  How you going with that John Z?  Such a switch is non-trivial because I need to test that I can restore, esp the system partition.

Has anyone tried downloading a W10 ISO and doing an upgrade using that, rather than relying on Windows Update?  I thought that it may have be a way to avoid some of the upgrade problems.  I had a report from someone who I regard as very IT-literate that some of the upgrade issues were actually due to overloaded MS servers.  You'd think that's less of an issue now.

[Carlo Didier]

Has anyone tried downloading a W10 ISO and doing an upgrade using that, rather than relying on Windows Update?

I'm not sure if you'll get the option to upgrade that way, maybe only a clean install. Haven't tried that.
One thing you should pay attention to is activation. If you do the upgrade, then Windows 10 will be activated for that machine and if you later do a clean install on the same machine, it will automatically activate without a problem.

If you don't do the upgrade, but a clean install right away, you will run into activation problems, because you won't have a valid license key. I don't know which procedure to follow then to get it activated.

Note that when you do the clean install, it will ask you twice for a license key. In this case, just skip that each time. W10 will activate fine as it will detect that it has already been activated for that machine before (by the upgrade). You only need to enter a key if you purchased a new license.

[Ferdinand]

If you do the upgrade, then Windows 10 will be activated for that machine and if you later do a clean install on the same machine, it will automatically activate without a problem.

I realise this.  It's supposed to be one of the attractions, for frequent reinstallers.

If you don't do the upgrade, but a clean install right away, you will run into activation problems, because you won't have a valid license key. I don't know which procedure to follow then to get it activated.

I am fairly certain that you will be asked for  a serial and you can give it your current W7/W8 serial.  That's how I did a fresh install of a technical preview of the RTM version (which will expire at some stage).  Then activation is tied to that machine, as in the upgrade case.

I am fairly sure that you can upgrade in place via the ISO, but it would be nice to have first-hand confirmation.  It's a much more efficient way for those with a number of machines to upgrade.

[RalfC]

Has anyone tried downloading a W10 ISO and doing an upgrade using that, rather than relying on Windows Update?

I'm not sure if you'll get the option to upgrade that way, maybe only a clean install. Haven't tried that.

I did the update on two computers (one with Win7 other with Win8.1) with the ISO-Image (burnt to DVD) both seemed to work afterwards with activated Win10.

Regards,
Ralf

[hro]

Has anyone tried downloading a W10 ISO and doing an upgrade using that, rather than relying on Windows Update?

I'm not sure if you'll get the option to upgrade that way, maybe only a clean install. Haven't tried that.

I did the update on two computers (one with Win7 other with Win8.1) with the ISO-Image (burnt to DVD) both seemed to work afterwards with activated Win10.

Regards,
Ralf

Hi Ralf,
Yes I did. I did this for W10 Professional and W10 Enterprise. Both downloaded .iso let me do an in-place upgrade without any problem.

N.B. You don't need to burn a DVD, you an also 'burn' the image on a USB stick with a program like 'Windows 7 USB DVD Download Tool'.

[Ferdinand]

Thanks, that's reassuring.

[Photon]

...updating all these systems and virtual environments after a Microsoft patch takes several hours. I hope that most users will switch to Windows 10 so I can reduce these efforts.

Mario, I appreciate your effort! I am sorry, I certainly will not switch soon to Win10. Today I disabled the Win7 update KB3035583 with its taskbar Win10 notification. I recently switched back from Win8.1 to Win7 on two machines and finally I can work efficiently and with less limitations again. Win7 will be supported with extended (=security) updates until 14.01.2020. After that deadline Imatch will hopefully run on Linux! :-)

May be you can make a online survey about the statistical distribution of OS version among Imatch users in this forum? Does the forum platform support such surveys with one-time votes of registered users?

Luckily Imatch is not calling home like Win10 for transmission of such PC details including specific user data! The opt-out principle in Win10 for all the calling home does look very questionable and does not create confidence.

Martin

[Mario]

After that deadline Imatch will hopefully run on Linux! :-)

Most unlikely.

In that year, most software will run in the cloud ('software as a service'). It will not be really important anymore which operating software is running the cloud. Or what is running on your client. Or which kind of client you use.

IMatch running on a server / in the cloud with a user interface (client) running on all platforms, from smart phone to high-end PC is my long-term goal.
I'm already making some good progress in that direction. If the server/cloud runs on your own computer or you just use a service is then up to you. I use smart phones, tablets, a smart TV and high-end workstation computers every day. I want to see IMatch capable of running on all these devices in the future    

I'm using W7 only on one PC - it looks a bit old on modern computers once you have switched to Windows 10. I skipped Windows 8, which felt like a lot like Vista to me. But Windows 10 is a again a really workable version of Windows, whether you use it on a workstation with two 4K screens, or on a tablet. I like it. I have one PC running on Windows 7, but that one will be switched as well to Windows 10 in a couple of weeks. And you can just disable all cloud-based and 'call home' functions in Windows 10 - which is a lot more control that you get on Android or IOs. And you cannot use cloud-based features without exchanging data with the cloud - on neither system, including Linux. It's up to you whether or not you want to use these services.

I will surely cease support for Windows 7 before 2020. To many of the new and exciting Windows functions require at least Windows 8 and I won't avoid using them in IMatch just in order to keep up support for Windows 7 for such a long time. Or built two versions of IMatch, once which still runs on Windows 7 and others which run on Windows 8 and later. Toolkit vendors will also stop supporting Windows 7 in maybe a year or two...

At least Microsoft is supporting their operating systems for 10 years and more. On Android, you won't get even critical security updates if your smart phone is older than 2 or 3 years... 

[sinus]

I am running Win7 Home.

I think, I will wait to install Win 10 some weeks. Maybe there are still some bugs and so on, better for me, to wait. 

[RalfC]

I think, I will wait to install Win 10 some weeks. Maybe there are still some bugs and so on, better for me, to wait. 

I don't think that there is a real need - except if you have some important work going on for which you need the computer -  to wait some more weeks.
There is no such thing as bug-free SW. The question is only if you notice the bugs (e.g. prevent you from working) or not.

If you make an image of your HD before upgrading, you could always go back to that state if needed... (and the work in IMatch [between upgrade and going back] could be restored with Pack&Go  ).

And for those who are concerned about the data sending towards MS and understand German: Under http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Windows-10-Datensammelwut-beherrschen-2774941.html?hg=1&hgi=0&hgf=false you'll find some tips what to switch off...

Regards,
Ralf

[Carlo Didier]

In the context of calling home, you should know that, what many users don't realize, you don't need a microsoft account (or at least you don't need to use it) for logon in Windows 8 or 10.
I do have an account with Microsoft (for license registrations), but never use it for anything else. All my user accounts on my PCs are local accounts. A normal account for day to day work and an admin account which I only use when needed (like software installations).

[sinus]

If you make an image of your HD before upgrading, you could always go back to that state if needed... (and the work in IMatch [between upgrade and going back] could be restored with Pack&Go  ).

Regards,
Ralf

Thanks, Ralf
But if I hear "Image of my HD", I loose my nerves.
Why the heck can modern softwar do this not automatically of whatever is necessary.
I click on "Win 10", it will be installed automatically and if there is a problem, it should simply go back also by itself.

OK, I know, if I do some thoughts and read about "Image a HD" and so on, I will be able to do so.
But, if I think at my brother or even father or other people, who are not that familiar with such things, computer are simply still too difficult.

My 2 cents.

[pajaro]

After that deadline Imatch will hopefully run on Linux! :-)

Most unlikely.

In that year, most software will run in the cloud ('software as a service'). It will not be really important anymore which operating software is running the cloud. Or what is running on your client. Or which kind of client you use.

IMatch running on a server / in the cloud with a user interface (client) running on all platforms, from smart phone to high-end PC is my long-term goal.
I'm already making some good progress in that direction. If the server/cloud runs on your own computer or you just use a service is then up to you. I use smart phones, tablets, a smart TV and high-end workstation computers every day. I want to see IMatch capable of running on all these devices in the future    

IMatch running on a server - does that mean that I would need to be connected to the Internet to be able to use IMatch? I hope I am wrong...

To be honest I do not feel the need to run the latest OS. I am perfectly happy with Win7. I installed Win10 on my laptop and do not see any significant improvement. And there is a privacy issue...so I do not know if it is worth keeping it. When I use I do it offline, for the Internet connection I use Linux Mint on my dual-boot machine.

Pavel.

[Mario]

IMatch running on a server - does that mean that I would need to be connected to the Internet to be able to use IMatch? I hope I am wrong...

a) The world is going 'always on-line' quickly. Many software in use today even assumes that you have an Internet connection.
b) 'Mobile' devices replace the standard PC in many areas.
c) A whatever 'IMatch server' could also run on your local PC or tablet.
Or in your private cloud.
Or on a small 50 US$ server you keep somewhere in your local network for such purposes. It's amazing how much power you can pack today in US$ 50 hardware. Just wait a two years and you can run Windows 10+ in a virtual machine side-by-side with a Linus system on these small boxes.

Or you run it in a virtual Windows system you lease for a few dollars a month from Microsoft, Google, Amazon or another cloud service provider.
Automatic backed up, with versions, automatically. Revert back to a known state (e.g. after a virus or a bad software installation) in seconds. Automatically kept up-to-date with security updates. You install the software you want and just use it.
And then you can use IMatch from your smart phone as well as your tablet, or quickly browse your files on the big TV set if you want to.

Or you run in on your PC, as before. This is about giving you more options, not less.

[Menace]

I try this cloud-stuff (lifedrive). It would be great, if I just have the possibility of a 16 000+ Internet. But I am far away from this and old fashioned. That's, why C6 will be my last Adobe Product. I want't my stuff on my PC and the posiblity to use it, how long I want. So....

... it's good to hear, that I can use IMatch like now (local, on Desktop-PC). 

[Mario]

That's, why C6 will be my last Adobe Product.

Adobe has cunningly tied support for newer RAW formats to their latest products. New cameras are only supported in new LR/PS versions.
If you shoot RAW you either need to convert them to DNG to use them with your old CS products (unless Adobe changes DNG as well so it cannot be longer read by non-subscription software) or you need to go elsewhere.

[pajaro]

.

Or you run in on your PC, as before. This is about giving you more options, not less.

Thanks, Mario. This is great to hear. 

[Carlo Didier]

But if I hear "Image of my HD", I loose my nerves.
Why the heck can modern softwar do this not automatically of whatever is necessary.
I click on "Win 10", it will be installed automatically and if there is a problem, it should simply go back also by itself.

Actually, if you do an upgrade (i.e. no clean install) of Windows 10, you can go back, but only during the first month. W10 will keep a copy of your old Windows and you can revert to W7 or W8. Though I prefer doing a clean image of the system partition, outside and independent of Windows (or any other OS for that).

[sinus]

Thanks, Carlo!

Well, I do still waiting a bit. As soon as the days are shorter, I will try to install Win 10.
Life is changing and some changes we can simply not prevent.

[Menace]

That's, why C6 will be my last Adobe Product.

If you shoot RAW you either need to convert them to DNG to use them with your old CS products (unless Adobe changes DNG as well so it cannot be longer read by non-subscription software) or you need to go elsewhere.

After trying LR I allways use Capture One Pro-Versions because of the results I get. That's why I start looking for a good DAM, too, because LR is to limited. Now, with IMatch + C1 I'm quite happy, even if C1 a little bit awkward with its datasystem.

[P.Jones]

Luckily Imatch is not calling home like Win10 for transmission of such PC details including specific user data! The opt-out principle in Win10 for all the calling home does look very questionable and does not create confidence.

Martin

Others think it looks questionable too

http://www.zdnet.com/article/bittorrent-tracker-blocks-windows-10-users/?tag=nl.e539&s_cid=e539&ttag=e539&ftag=TRE17cfd61

[Carlo Didier]

... even if C1 a little bit awkward with its datasystem.

Nice understatement 

[Ferdinand]

... even if C1 a little bit awkward with its datasystem.

Nice understatement 

So is that

[RalfC]

If you make an image of your HD before upgrading, you could always go back to that state if needed... (and the work in IMatch [between upgrade and going back] could be restored with Pack&Go  ).

Regards,
Ralf

Thanks, Ralf
But if I hear "Image of my HD", I loose my nerves.
Why the heck can modern softwar do this not automatically of whatever is necessary.

No problem, Marcus. I know that many computer 'solutions' are problems in themself (e.g. requiring lots of training, helpdesk, etc.).

There are a programs [e.g. Acronis TrueImage] for Windows, which can create such images. At least TrueImage (the version I have seen) is fairly easy to use and the image is also a nice backup solution (esp. with scheduled activities) in case that the HD breaks down.

It is true that Windows10 allows to go back if you make an upgrade but what if e.g. the power is cut during the up-/downgrade process and Windows is no longer able to start?
The backup-image would be a safety net, helping to get the system back into a known state quickly.

Regards,
Ralf

[Mario]

Although Windows 8 / 10 have a quite comfortable backup built-in, an 'image' application like TrueImage or similar is pure gold.
The initial backup takes a while, but daily (or even hourly!) backups are fast. You can go back several days or weeks, restoring entire disks or single files.
If you boot disk fails, you create a boot CD-ROM or USB stick with TrueImage, but from it, and then restore your backup to your new disk. I have done that several times in the past, and it always worked without problems. I just upgraded from the 2010 version to the 2016 version which also supports Windows 10.

[Ferdinand]

I just upgraded from the 2010 version to the 2016 version which also supports Windows 10.

And your view of it is?  As I said above, one of several things holding me back is the possibility of switching to Macrium Reflect.   I lost a little confidence in ATI over the years.  I'd be interested in how you find the 2016 version after the 2010 version.

[Mario]

TI never failed on me and I use it since 2004.

I use only the most basic features (daily incremental backups of 5 hard disks to external USB drive, daily incremental backups of 2 hard disks to external USB drive, daily incremental backups of one SSD to USB stick (tablet)). I restore individual files occasionally by mounting backup drives via TI. I restored at least 10 disks over the years, and twice the boot disk of a computer, from scratch. Worked.

I don't have sufficient experience with the 2016 version as of yet so I cannot comment. So far it just worked. I did some test restores and they worked as well. 2016 is brand new and I only switched because the Windows 10 file system is no longer compatible with TI from 2010. I'm migrating all my backup disks over the next four weeks and then I will know more.

The also include something new named "Universal Restore" in the package. This seems to be the Acronis Boot Disk feature on steroids or something. I have not used this, but I will try it to see if I can boot my systems from whatever boot media they create. This is mandatory in order to restore a failed boot disk. Since I now again use single disks for the boot media (switched from RAID 1 regular hard disks to SSD on all machines) this may be required. Or not. The Pro-grade Samsung SSD's are so reliable (10 years warranty) that I doubt that they will fail in the usually two years I use them.

[P.Jones]

TI never failed on me and I use it since 2004.

The Pro-grade Samsung SSD's are so reliable (10 years warranty) that I doubt that they will fail in the usually two years I use them.

I had heard so many bad things about ATI that I use Macrium Reflect.

With my 2 systems, Win7 32bit on a Samsung 840evo SSD and Win8 64bit on a Samsung 850evo SSd, I made a disk image of Win8 then did the WinX upgrade.

I then did a new install of WinX on my old Corsair P3 SSD and then created a WinX image. I then put Win8 back on the 850evo SSD.

This now gives me 3 Windows versions. Win 8 will finally go when I am happy with WinX.

All this has worked fine untill last week when my Corsair SSD decided to fail and turned itself into a brick, I think it lasted about 4 1/2 years.

So at the moment I have restored my WinX image to an old HDD while I await delivery of my new Samsung Pro SSD I ordered yesterday.

[Ferdinand]

I have licenses for 2013 and 2014.  I installed 2013 about 2.5 years ago as part of my last minute move to W7.  As part of my testing the new OS install, I struggled to restore the system partition.  I found the older version, which was not supposed to be W7 compatible, easier and so I stuck with it.  Testing all this is time consuming.  Next time I will test before I upgrade, rather than when I'm in the middle of an upgrade and under time pressure.

One of the advantages of Macrium was supposed to be their responsiveness, i.e. quite the opposite of Acronis.

[lnh]

My W10 upgrades have been good so far, although holding off on the main desktop for a bit longer. Four year old Lenovo Thinkpad was absolutely transformed into a more responsive machine going from W7Pro to W10Pro. Followed what others have said, and didn't do a clean install until after the upgrade install. Also used the 3rd party utility "ProduKey" to extract the product key after the upgrade install and used it during the clean install when the Windows installer asks for the key (which you can ignore as said above). Windows should remember that the machine was activated, but just in case, have a copy of your key is a bit of insurance. It is a pain to neuter all the excessive "phone home" aspects of W10, and I believe I've seen some settings change on me and have to be reset manually.

Also did an upgrade on a newer Asus notebook. Running into an issue where the machine restarts when coming out of sleep. So far Asus support hasn't been able to come to the bottom of this issue. Just did a clean install on that machine, and the problem remains. The bios is so minimal, I don't see anything there which might be messing it up.

Mario - Android M will finally have a proper permission manager similar in scope to iOS. Now applications will have to figure out how to degrade gracefully when a particular permission is denied.

[Mario]

Mario - Android M will finally have a proper permission manager similar in scope to iOS. Now applications will have to figure out how to degrade gracefully when a particular permission is denied.

I know. But one of the major problems of the Android market is that you only get a fairly recent version of Android as long as your device has still warranty. If your device crosses the two year old border, you usually out of luck. Top-end products may even get an Android update in their third year, but that's the best you can get.

I'm no fan of throwing away perfectly working things or hardware, just because the vendor things it's too old to get updates. Even my almost three year old Samsung phone is running fast and doing a good job since working under CyanogenMod. The battery lasts a lot longer, none of the crap ware installed by Samsung and the phone company drags the phone done, everything responds fast. And I get security patches overnight if they are critical. This is how it should be. Or, and the hardware companies should be required by law to ship updates for Android for at least five years after the purchase. If Microsoft can deliver 10 years of support for a Windows version I buy, the big hardware and phone companies should be able to as well. The hardware is expensive enough as it is. Apple always boasts about their 50% net margin per phone...

[Mario]

Why Acronis 2016 is rubbish and why I'm looking for alternatives...


After working with Acrobis TrueImage 2016 for a week now, I'm planning to ask for a refund. This software is really bad.

I upgraded my main workstation computer (currently on Windows 7) in preparation for upgrading it to Windows 10. My tried-and-trusted Acronis TrueImage 2010 does not work on Windows 10 anymore. I used that software successfully since 2010, doing daily backups and occasional restores of single files, or even entire disks. Always worked,

1. Installing Acronis TrueImage 2016 (TI) on the computer.

It noticed that Acronis 2010 was installed. It instructed me to close the installation, remove Acronis 2010 via the control panel, then install 2016.
OK. I uninstalled TI 2010 and was asked to reboot. I rebooted.
Windows COULD NO LONGER START. Well, thank you very much.
I had to reboot into safe mode and manually remove all Acronis 2010 drivers, services and registry entries.
Windows was then able to start again. This is not something a typical user can handle.

2. Installing TI 2016 went well.

3. Needed to find a magnifying glass to be able to read some of the dialogs in the TI 2016 user interface.
The software looks like something an Android app designer has designed, but does not work on large screens.
The software is marked as "DPI aware" which means that Windows does not scale the user interface. But TI 2016' fancy user interface apparently does not handle large DPI screens, and some of the dialog boxes use fonts merely 3 pixels high...

4. Created the same backup jobs as in TI 2010: One full backup, then incremental backups until the disk is full.

5. The first backup runs to 99% (5 hours), then stops. I wait for an hour, then reboot the system. BAD.

6. Start the backup again the next day. Same result. O-KAY...

7. Re-installed TI 2016. Now the backup job runs through.

8. Do some test restores of selected files and folders, Works ok.

...

9. Today: I swapped the external disks, but did not assign the correct drive letter after connecting the new disk. Can happen.
TI 2016 gave no warning! A backup software which does not show REALLY BIG MESSAGES when a catastrophic failure happens (e.g. backup media not available) is useless. And DANGEROUS.

10. After re-connecting the disk, I tried to manually start the backup. The green button "Backup Now" goes gray for a second. Then green again. No backup started. No error messages. Nothing. I rebooted. Same effect. TI does create the "Acronis Backup" folder on the disk, but fails to backup anything.

And, TI not only does not bother it's users when bad problems happen, they have even removed the "backup log file" feature in TI 2016. A backup software which does not allow me to see if the backup worked OK, which disks were backed up, how long it took etc. I'm shaking my head so fast I'm getting dizzy...

Acronis 2010 was so good and worked for me for 5 years.

Apparently over these years Acronis has lost track of what the core and main purpose of a backup software should be: Doing reliable backups, day-to-day with a minimum of fuzz. They instead added all kinds of extra tools, re-designed the user interface several times, dumbed down everything for the generation of  "app users" out there and invested (apparently) a huge amount of time and work in their "backup to cloud feature". Which would not only lock me into the Acronis cloud (dangerous) but is also technically impossible when your daily backup volume is between 10 and 30 GB (it would take days to upload that to cloud).

Oh, and their customer support:

- E-Mails are answered after 3 days. The tone is friendly, but
- The first email is always "Use the Acronis system report" tool to generate a system report and sent it to us.
(This tool collects a massive amount of data about your computer, from critical system files to the Windows registry and whatnot. No way I would send this to an external company).
When I told them I cannot send all the data and they should tell me which of the log files they create they really need, communication ceased.

Their user community is mostly questions, but very little answers. I have seen only very, very few posts from Acronis staff. Reminds me of the Spotify community 

So, I plan to get my upgrade money back from Acronis and I will look into solutions like Macrium Reflect  or Paragon over the next weeks.

[jch2103]

Useful review. Please let us know when you've found a solution that works properly.

[Ferdinand]

This report is both good and bad.  It's good to have my limited experiences and deep suspicions confirmed.  It's bad that it happened.  I'm keen to hear of what you choose, because it is likely to affect what I chose.

Question:  How do you know that ATI 2010 is not Windows 10 compatible?  Because they said so?  Did you try doing a backup and restoring?  Because my ancient version (version before 2010 I think, the last without a year designation), was not supposed to be W7 compatible, but it worked with a little effort.

[hro]

I share Mario's sentiments about TrueImage, i.e. recent versions got "simplified" to the extent that they are no longer reassuring and user friendly. I'd like to be re-assured that my backup worked and will be usable for a restore. The limited logs and features in the recent versions don't assure me.

I have also been using TI back since 2010 and only kept using (and upgrading) it out of habit and to avoid the hassle of finding and setting up another solution. (I used Retrospect Backup before TI). Also agree that the cloud backup is pretty useless if you have daily large backups to do.

I am currently running TI2015 and that version is compatible with Windows 10, i.e. it does the backups. Haven't tried a proper restore yet and Mario's experience makes me nervous. So, I will also investigate other solutions, MacriumReflect got me interested and I will probably try it out.

[Mario]

When you install TI 2010 on a W10 system, Windows tells you that this software will not run. TI has to hook deep into the file system in order to do it's job and install a low-level service. The interfaces for these have changed in W8/10 and thus the TrueImage software from 2010 will no longer work. Which is OK if only the 2016 version of TI would be any good.

I don't need bells and whistles or a 'app-like' user interface. I need only the basic features, but done right.

The problem we see often is that companies need to find ways to monetize their user base (aka selling updates at regular intervals). I'm no exception. If I don't make enough money from IMatch to at least cover the costs, I won't further develop it. Easy.

The trick is go get your users to upgrade, e.g. by adding useful features, improving existing features etc. Or maybe you're lucky and by a change in Windows your old versions no longer run and users have to upgrade.

Acronis TI 2010 was pretty good and complete. There were a lot of features I never trusted or used (e.g. "Try and Buy" and suchlike), but they got the basic functionality working reliably. I back up several TB each months and it always worked. I also restore files or entire disks regularly, and it always worked.

But a software which does the job does not cause users to upgrade. Look at me: I bought TI 2010 in 2010 and used it since then. Because it worked.
It's like all the users who still run IMatch 3.6 ...

Acronis had to add things here and there, change the UI and do other things in order to get users to upgrade. This often leads to feature creep and reallocation of developer resources to sidetrack features. And implementing a cloud-based backup infrastructure is surely not easy and binds a lot of developer resources. No wonder that there is no time to maintain the basic functionality. We see this too often, unfortunately. I still remember the CD burning software which added a data shredder and music player feature to get users to upgrade...

One solution to this is what Adobe did: Forcing users into a subscription model. You have to pay each month, whether Adobe fixes bugs or not, or implements new features or not. Adobe has a steady cash flow and their hands in your wallet. And if you don't pay anymore, the software stops working and access to your files will be severely limited or even impossible. Adobe does not tell this explicitly, but I think for most users it will be a life-long subscription...

From my perspective, I can only hope that users value IMatch, the support they get from me, and all the work I put into the bi-weekly or monthly updates (about 50 free updates since the initial release of IMatch 5 in June last year). And that they buy the 5.5 upgrade once it becomes available.

[hro]

Mario,
I don't think you need to justify IMatch here. I see tremendous value in the product,  the support and new features you offer.  And I am very happy to part with my $$ to support you. And here lies the difference to TI.  I see diminishing value in the product, their support is at best average and they like me to upgrade to make use of features that are in my view marginal.

Glad I started evaluating Macrium. Funny though it has all the features I felt are missing or disappearing from TI. And it is very fast. I particularly like an add-on (still in pre-release) that allows you to take any image backup you made and configure it as an Hyper-V machine on the fly without lenghty conversion.  Very cool.

[medgeek]

How much for 5 to 5.5?  I'll be glad to pay now...

[Ferdinand]

How much for 5 to 5.5?  I'll be glad to pay now...

Please form an orderly queue ........

[Mario]

How much for 5 to 5.5?  I'll be glad to pay now...

Thanks. I think you will find the upgrade fee reasonable. 5.5 will contain some nice new things, optimizations and so on. And of course the 5.5.4 which follows the initial 5.5 within a few weeks will also include bug fixes, enhancements etc. My release plan extends all the way to version 6...

[lnh]

I'm currently using TI 2015 on W8.1Pro and it drives me crazy at times. 100% agree with Mario on the UI of the recent versions compared to older ones. Not a step forward. My issue is that I backup onto removable HDDs which are in SATA bays. With this type of setup, the drive letter associated with your disk can and will change depending on what else is attached at the time. TI is fussy to the point of being useless in resolving this sort of problem. You can relocate an existing backup, but if TI can't find your backup, it is useless. Haven't found a way to resolve this by pointing TI at the current location. I've even gone into the Windows disk management utility and changed the drive letter to what TI was expecting, and that doesn't work either. My current experiment has been to assign my removable drive to "Z" before doing the latest full backup and will change it to "Z" in the future if Windows doesn't already mount it there BEFORE starting up TI. I'd also be interested in alternatives, but want something that can do incremental backups as well.

[Mario]

I'm currently trying Macrium Reflect.
This software is a no-nonsense backup software, like TI was in 2010.

So far I have successfully created a full backup and several daily incremental backups.
The daily backup with Reflect takes 11 minutes (Acronis TI 2010: 11 minutes, Acronis TI 2016: 30 minutes!)
I have successfully restored individual files, folders and even an entire partition with Reflect.
Mounting disks from the backup in Windows Explorer takes only a few seconds, then you can restore files using standard copy/paste. Good.

I created a boot media and booted from it. Relfect uses Windows PE, not Linux like Acronis for this.
WIndows PE booted nicely and Reflect opened. I could restore files and partitions from there.

So far this looks good.
The only (minor) issue I have found so far is that there is no indicator in the tray (task bar) when Reflect runs the daily backup.
Reflect backups must run under an Admin account (like TI) and you can see the progress when you start Reflect. A tray icon like Acronis has would be nice, though.

I will run some other tests, e.g. like Relfect behaves when the backup media is off-line when the daily backup runs. TI 2010 complained with a message box. TI 2016 did not run the backup and have no warning (a no-go). Let's see if Reflect can inform the user properly in that case.

[hro]

I am also currently evaluating Reflect and are so far very pleased. I may well buy it rather than upgrading to TI2016.
I also find that TI is very picky with assigning drive letters and in the past I had many times to recreate backups as previous ones couldn't be found. My concern is also in reliably restoring a backup. A backup may have verified ok  but when trying to restore with the emergency recovery disk it would say that the backup is corrupt.

With Reflect I booted into the emergency recovery environment and had now trouble finding the backup on my NAS and restoring on a test system.
There is one thing I like in TI in that I can exclude directory structures, even when doing an 'image' backup. Shouldn't probably do this anyway and move these directories onto separate volumes.

[thrinn]

To solve issues with changing drive letters, I use a small tool called USBDLM (USB Drive Letter Manager). Basically, it is a rule-based approach to assing specific drive letters to removable drives. For example, you can assign drive letters based on the volume label, volume size, device id etc. I think Windows 10 is not officially supported yet, but USBDLM is still under active development according to the changelog. And Windows 10 ist mentioned therein.
As the name suggests, USBDLM is targeted at USB hard drives and sticks, so I do not know if it works with removable SATA drives. USBDLM is free for private use, and there is an free trial period anyway.

I know that we diverted a bit from the original subject of this post, but it is Off-Topic anyway. 

[lnh]

To solve issues with changing drive letters, I use a small tool called USBDLM (USB Drive Letter Manager).
...

As the name suggests, USBDLM is targeted at USB hard drives and sticks, so I do not know if it works with removable SATA drives.

Thanks for the info. I'll take a look. Sounds easier than always going into the Windows disk management utility. Hopefully it will work with removable SATA drives as well.

With that said, I'm inspired to try out Reflect as well. People have been complaining about the drive letter thing w/ TI on their forum for many years now through multiple generations of the product. If I remember correctly, many releases ago TI would allow you to handle this problem.

[Mario]

Thanks for the info. I'll take a look. Sounds easier than always going into the Windows disk management utility.

You can also change/assign driver letters from the command line using the built-in diskpart application.

[Ferdinand]

I'm currently trying Macrium Reflect.
This software is a no-nonsense backup software, like TI was in 2010.

Mario, did you reach a conclusion on which product to use?  If so, was it MR?  Did you get around to trialling anything else?