Potential New User - Capture1 11x iMatch Workflow

[sawwhetowl]

Hi

First post.  Refuge from Aperture.  Then I tried Lightroom, then Photo Supreme w/Lightroom, then hoping On1 Raw would have a descent DAM (as well as a great RAM editor and a enhance GUI), then waiting for Luminar's promised DAM this quarter.  And perhaps C1's Media Pro would go somewhere, but alas, as Aperture, it became abandonware- sure glad I did not start using it.   You know, I need to give up on a great photo editor with a great DAM and move on.  So I choose C1 and possibly iMatch- last day of trial 

I have 80K pictures.  Half heartedly added metadata and light photo editing the past 8 years.  Now getting back to photo editing and metadata.  I have .xml, .pp3, .dop, .on1, and .DS_Store file extensions and [Developed], CaptureOne and [Originals] subfolders.  Somewhere there is likely Luminar file extension lurking as well.

I consulted the following iMatch link "Working with Capture One Pro V10 and iMatch: https://www.photools.com/community/index.php?topic=6623.msg46165#msg46165 but came up with a possible workflow process to have pictures already in iMatch before editing in C1 and wanted to run it by the users of iMatch and C1:

• Import images into iMatch
• Create 'Regular' Categories from the @Keywords categories created during the import
• Delete @Keyword categories as photographs are assigned to Categories
• Delete the.xml files.  Really have no need for them unless Mario gets hit by a bus- there are a lot of buses in Germany 
• Create C1 catalog of all pictures.  Export as jpeg/tiff but select for keywords "None" in the C1 export GUI
• Synchronize jpegs back with iMatch.  Even though the keywords created through various programs appear in C1 (most be impeded in the RAW/jpgeg/etc. files), when the C1 generated jpegs are synchronized in iMatch they do not appear in the @Keywords category nor in the Metadata/Keywords windows as i click through the files.

Is it this simple or do I need to make it more complicated as the above referenced post?  Am I missing a big gotcha down the C1/iMatch marriage highway?

[Mario]

Hi, welcome to IMatch.

Your IMatch trial does not expire, only your IMatch database becomes read-only after 30 days. You can still use IMatch, but no operations which require changes to the database. The licensed version of course opens your database in fully writable mode. You can also create a new database if you need more than a month to decide if IMatch is for you.

I have never used C1 so I'm no expert...

(XMP/IPTC) Keywords are good. Having your keywords and descriptions and other metadata properly enclosed in your image files keeps your data safe, allows all capable applications to see the data and to communicate with other applications in your workflow. IMatch takes great care (with the help of the renowned ExifTool) to produce high-quality and compatible metadata.

Categories should be used in addition to keywords because they can do lots of things keywords cannot do. From easily combining keywords to automatically organizing your files.

I would keep the 'public' keywords (the ones you want to share with other applications) as keywords, and use categories for other organization purposes.

Delete the.xml files.

What do these files contain? Probably some custom metadata written by one of your applications? I think C1 writes some settings and partial metadata in XML?

Synchronize jpegs back with iMatch.  Even though the keywords created through various programs appear in C1 (most be impeded in the RAW/jpgeg/etc. files), when the C1 generated jpegs are synchronized in iMatch they do not appear in the @Keywords category nor in the Metadata/Keywords windows as i click through the files.

Where does C1 store keywords? There are only 3 'official' places:  Legacy IPTC data (embedded in the image), XMP keywords (embedded in the image or XML sidecar file) and XMP hierarchical keywords (embedded/XMP file). IMatch supports all three standards and automatically maps IPTC/XMP keywords on import into hierarchical keywords. This is usually fully automatic.

Are you sure C1 has written the keywords in the proper place?
Tip: You can check the file in the ExifTool Command Processor in IMatch. Use the "List Metadata" preset to see all metadata in the image. If the data is in the XMP file, use the corresponding preset to see all metadata in the XMP file. This will show you if your keywords are in the file. If not, IMatch cannot see them.

The only exception would be that you:

a) have modified XMP data, including keywords in IMatch, and
b) have not written this data back to the file, and
c) have metadata protection enabled in IMatch (Edit > Preferences > Metadata 2), and
d) modify metadata in other applications

When IMatch detects that a file has been modified, it rescans the file to update the database. But if metadata protection is enabled and unwritten metadata for the file exists in the IMatch database, modified metadata in the file will not be imported. IMatch protects the changes you have made in IMatch from being wiped out by other applications that way.

In general: When you use many applications for image editing/processing you will notice that many give a damn about metadata, standards or interoperability. Features like that don't get you points in the magazines and photo blogs, they don't make pretty pictures for ads, ...
Many users don't notice (or care for) such problems and shortcomings unless they want to, or have to, move to another applications. And then realize what a mess their precious metadata is in, that much of their data is tucked away in some proprietary database without documentation or export features and so on.

I see that often. That's why IMatch is a sticker for standards and open formats.
Long-time IMatch users (and there are users who use IMatch for 10 or 15 years!) have swapped their image processors, RAW processors many times over the years. But had their images organized in IMatch all the years and never lost anything in the process.

[sawwhetowl]

Hi Mario,

Your IMatch trial does not expire, only your IMatch database becomes read-only after 30 days. You can still use IMatch, but no operations which require changes to the database. The licensed version of course opens your database in fully writable mode. You can also create a new database if you need more than a month to decide if IMatch is for you.

Yes, I discovered if I create a new database I can continue to test.  Very nice!

(XMP/IPTC) Keywords are good. Having your keywords and descriptions and other metadata properly enclosed in your image files keeps your data safe, allows all capable applications to see the data and to communicate with other applications in your workflow. IMatch takes great care (with the help of the renowned ExifTool) to produce high-quality and compatible metadata.  I would keep the 'public' keywords (the ones you want to share with other applications) as keywords, and use categories for other organization purposes.

In Aperture, I made my hierarchical keywords way too complex (not a stock photographer, etc) and am looking at simplifying things.   Most complexity will be places and taxonomy for bird photographs (such as family, genus, and species).  Based on your comments, I might make the Categories temporary holding "cells", purge the keywords and populate based on the categories.  I could see just using the @Keywords category for this task.

What do these files contain? Probably some custom metadata written by one of your applications? I think C1 writes some settings and partial metadata in XML?

Iptc, rdf and exif information.  In Aperture, I had a managed library where all the photographs were loaded in the library.  When I migrated from Aperture, I had to export all the pictures back out.  In hindsight a foolish thing.  I believe the xmp files were created then. 

Where does C1 store keywords? There are only 3 'official' places:  Legacy IPTC data (embedded in the image), XMP keywords (embedded in the image or XML sidecar file) and XMP hierarchical keywords (embedded/XMP file). IMatch supports all three standards and automatically maps IPTC/XMP keywords on import into hierarchical keywords. This is usually fully automatic.

Are you sure C1 has written the keywords in the proper place?

I do not believe the xmp files were created in C1.  Running ExifTool, "List metadata", displays the keywords at:  [IPTC]          Keywords   

When IMatch detects that a file has been modified, it rescans the file to update the database. But if metadata protection is enabled and unwritten metadata for the file exists in the IMatch database, modified metadata in the file will not be imported. IMatch protects the changes you have made in IMatch from being wiped out by other applications that way.

I will turn on metadata protection.  Very useful feature.  I believe the C1 post I mentioned on the earlier post hinted at this feature but I didn't quite follow what they were saying.

In general: When you use many applications for image editing/processing you will notice that many give a damn about metadata, standards or interoperability. Features like that don't get you points in the magazines and photo blogs, they don't make pretty pictures for ads, ...
Many users don't notice (or care for) such problems and shortcomings unless they want to, or have to, move to another applications. And then realize what a mess their precious metadata is in, that much of their data is tucked away in some proprietary database without documentation or export features and so on.

I was watching a metadata seminar, likely C1, and they were typing in a keyword and several misspellings showed up as they typed the word.  Seems like it was case senitive and there was a match for both proper case and single case.  I just wanted to laugh.   

[Menace]

Most complexity will be places and taxonomy for bird photographs (such as family, genus, and species).  Based on your comments, I might make the Categories temporary holding "cells", purge the keywords and populate based on the categories.  I could see just using the @Keywords category for this task.

Hi! I have a lot of different species (not just birds). I create categories with the categorie-panel and/or thesaurus. After creating and adding it, I drag & drop the most important categories (most birds) to my favorite panel. Same to my private photos. That improves the speed again.

The last year I begin also to use a small part of "Darwin"-Core to add this metadata too. After this, I can rename very fast the pictures with their correct species-name.

[sinus]

Long-time IMatch users (and there are users who use IMatch for 10 or 15 years!) ...

and 17 years! 

[Mario]

I do not believe the xmp files were created in C1.

You wrote XML files in your post, this was what confused me. Files wit the .XMP extension contain XMP metadata for your files and IMatch will automatically import the data from the XMP file when it imports your files. When you image files also contain embedded legacy IPTC data, EXIF and GPS data, IMatch will import that data as well and produce a 'super' XMP record my merging and mapping all the data according to the Metadata Working Group rules and recommendations. This give you the best, most compliant and compatible metadata.

If you need to 'cleanup' metadata mess, IMatch is probably the best tool for that purpose.
Before you start I recommend you make yourself aquatinted with the Keyword Panel (which offers many time-saver features), the Thesaurus, the @Keywords category and all the functionality available for it and Favorites.  And categories, of course, if you want to use them. Metadata Templates can add metadata to many tags at once, even using variables to 'create' metadata on-the-fly as needed from other tags. Very powerful feature.

It's normal when your initial workflow is not optimal. Hence, try with a bunch of sample files. Build your thesaurus. Read the help for the Keyword Panel (https://www.photools.com/help/imatch/#md_keywords_panel.htm) because this explains all the not immediately obvious time-saver and data quality features. I also recommend looking at the knowledge-base articles:

Use Visual Clues to Improve Your Workflow
Free Controlled Vocabularies for IMatch in case there is also a taxonomy available for your bird photography (usually is).

Then you can process literally tons of files in a very short time. Working with keywords in IMatch is as comfortable and fast as working with categories (to some extent) and since IMatch performs all changes only in the database it is also very fast.

Moving files between keywords, 'renaming' keywords, moving files up and down the keyword hierarchy or your taxonomy is also very fast, via @Keywords, drag & drop, copy & paste, whatever you prefer.

[sawwhetowl]

Most complexity will be places and taxonomy for bird photographs (such as family, genus, and species).  Based on your comments, I might make the Categories temporary holding "cells", purge the keywords and populate based on the categories.  I could see just using the @Keywords category for this task.

Hi! I have a lot of different species (not just birds). I create categories with the categorie-panel and/or thesaurus. After creating and adding it, I drag & drop the most important categories (most birds) to my favorite panel. Same to my private photos. That improves the speed again.

The last year I begin also to use a small part of "Darwin"-Core to add this metadata too. After this, I can rename very fast the pictures with their correct species-name.

Your post got me looking online for a keyword vocabulary for bird species.  Find one but it is all the birds of the world.  Was almost tempted to import it but, unfortunately, I will never come close to needing all those bird species in my keywords.  I will only add the birds I currently have pictures for.

How do you handle species splits and lumps?

[sawwhetowl]

Long-time IMatch users (and there are users who use IMatch for 10 or 15 years!) ...

and 17 years! 

I have one program I am still using for 21 years.  Unfortunately the programer has not kept up with technology.  But it gets the job down.

[sawwhetowl]

I do not believe the xmp files were created in C1.

You wrote XML files in your post, this was what confused me. Files wit the .XMP extension contain XMP metadata for your files and IMatch will automatically import the data from the XMP file when it imports your files. When you image files also contain embedded legacy IPTC data, EXIF and GPS data, IMatch will import that data as well and produce a 'super' XMP record my merging and mapping all the data according to the Metadata Working Group rules and recommendations. This give you the best, most compliant and compatible metadata.

If you need to 'cleanup' metadata mess, IMatch is probably the best tool for that purpose.
Before you start I recommend you make yourself aquatinted with the Keyword Panel (which offers many time-saver features), the Thesaurus, the @Keywords category and all the functionality available for it and Favorites.  And categories, of course, if you want to use them. Metadata Templates can add metadata to many tags at once, even using variables to 'create' metadata on-the-fly as needed from other tags. Very powerful feature.

It's normal when your initial workflow is not optimal. Hence, try with a bunch of sample files. Build your thesaurus. Read the help for the Keyword Panel (https://www.photools.com/help/imatch/#md_keywords_panel.htm) because this explains all the not immediately obvious time-saver and data quality features. I also recommend looking at the knowledge-base articles:

Use Visual Clues to Improve Your Workflow
Free Controlled Vocabularies for IMatch in case there is also a taxonomy available for your bird photography (usually is).

Then you can process literally tons of files in a very short time. Working with keywords in IMatch is as comfortable and fast as working with categories (to some extent) and since IMatch performs all changes only in the database it is also very fast.

Moving files between keywords, 'renaming' keywords, moving files up and down the keyword hierarchy or your taxonomy is also very fast, via @Keywords, drag & drop, copy & paste, whatever you prefer.

Sorry, .xml are the metadata files I use for GIS files.

I have about a 1,500 keyword mess to clean up.  Does the metdata write back command modify information stored in the image?

[Menace]

I will never come close to needing all those bird species in my keywords.  I will only add the birds I currently have pictures for.

Same here. I just looking in wikipedia to get a most accurate keyword.

How do you handle species splits and lumps?

I guess I haven't had such case yet?

[Mario]

Does the metdata write back command modify information stored in the image?

Yes. That is the purpose of this command.
It transfers modified metadata from the database back into your image files (and XMP sidecar files).
During that process IMatch also performs the mapping between XMP and EXIF, legacy IPTC, GPS to keep everything up-to-date and in sync.

As always, the IMatch Help System topic for Metadata Write-back has all the details and background info.

[akirot]

@Menace: very elaborate approach!
I wonder if you have an idea/recommendation for the handling of foreign languages too?
You use German for the vernacular name and of course Latin as the unique scientific name.
My "problem": Depending on where I have sighted a bird most often the English or Spanish name comes into my mind at first. (Sometimes the German name sounds very complicated and less speaking to me, despite German being my mother tongue.)
So, do you have any idea how to handle the vernacular name in various languages in parallel?
Any hint is much appreciated. Thank you!

[Ger]

Created a new topic for Birds keywords as it's a bit off-topic to the subject:

https://www.photools.com/community/index.php?topic=8339.msg58546#msg58546

[Menace]

So, do you have any idea how to handle the vernacular name in various languages in parallel?
Any hint is much appreciated. Thank you!

I will answer in the other thread. https://www.photools.com/community/index.php?topic=8339.0;topicseen